Posts Tagged ‘Thai Language’

Gardening Contract For Our Retirement House In Pakchong (Pak Chong), Thailand

Thailand Landscaping And Garden Design Contract For Our Retirement House In Pakchong (Pak Chong), Thailand

Thoughts, ideas and a plan to make a beautiful Thailand garden design based on other Thailand gardens.

As I write this the house itself (except for the second floor kitchen) is finished but the Thai garden is still rough and needs landscaping and planting after.

My  15,000 Baht Landscaping And Gardening Budget.

I agreed with Kanyah that I would pay for a Thai gardener to produce the Thai garden design and undertake the gardening etc, thinking it would cost a few hundred £. (£= Great British Pounds – Sterling), say maximum £500 = 15,000 Baht. I was prepared to pay for a professional Thai landscape design rather than let Kanyah struggle with the Thailand garden design.

When I retire to Thailand I want a nice cool and beautiful Thailand garden, somewhere to really relax after a morning in the workshop making my models.

One thing we wanted was a “covered terrace” for want of a better word – an area with some wooden posts that climbing plants grow over it and make a shady and cool place to sit in the hot weather.

The main areas of the land, front and back to be lawn (grassed) and planted with trees. Small climbing plants to go around the perimeter fence to hide it. I did not want any water features because they need a lot of maintenance.

Enter The Thai Gardener

Our neighbour, Noi, introduced us to a Thai gardener and he came to visit us.

The scope of the gardening work was discussed and I caught hold of a few pieces of the conversation which was taking place in the Thai language like ‘clearing the land’ is not included and ‘putting the new soil is not included’. When I heard a price of 200,000 Baht I said we would do the Thai gardening ourselves.

I just couldn’t understand why Kanyah can’t hire the labour and organise them to do the Thai gardening work.

There was also some discussion that there was currently no “Malaysian Grass” available. The gardener got on the phone to “head office” and that was confirmed. Also he said that “Malaysian Grass” cost 30 Baht per square metre. We had about 1,200 m2 to be covered by lawn so that would amount to 36,000 Baht. I wondered what the other 164,000 Baht would be spent on.

It seemed that the grass would be put down in pre-grown roll form. I suggested that Kanyah could simply get the labourers to place grass seed and that would be far cheaper. The gardener said that “They won’t sell you grass seed in Thailand”. I replied that I would send it to Kanyah by mail. That started a whole lot of conversation about send parcels by mail, import duty and so on.

Exit The Thai Gardener

I had heard enough and walked away. There was no way I was interested in that kind of rip-off.

After about an hour or so of noisy discussion between Kanyah, the Thai gardener and Noi, Kanyah explained that the Thai gardener would include the land clearing and put the soil for 120,000 Baht all-in price.

I Demand A Thai Landscape Gardening Contract

I kind of agreed to the revised offer for the gardening design and work but said I wanted everything written down into a contract. Having been stung by our first builder I was not prepared to agree to a deal based on a noisy conversation in the Thai language with a 120,000 Baht price tag attached to it and nothing written down.

The Thai gardener went away and said he would come back another day with the contract.

He did come back a couple of days later but without a contract. After much discussion between Kanyah, the Thai gardener and our neighbour, Noi, he went off and return an hour later with a pre-written “Form of Contract” such as you can buy in stationery shops and places like Tesco Lotus here in Thailand.

From what I gathered the intention was to simply enter the names of the two parties (the Thai gardener and Kanyah), put the date and the cost and bingo! You have a contract.

Not The Kind Of Thai Landscape Gardening Contract I Had In Mind

That was not at all what I had in mind. I wanted a proper description of what was to be provided for the Thailand garden. If possible with sketches and the type and quantity of plants itemised. I wanted to know – in written form – exactly what kind of Thailand garden design was being provided for my money.

Kanyah kind of understood what I was driving at – particularly when I said a wanted to see a list – she knows what a list is – and she took out an exercise book and got the Thai gardener to write a list of what he was to provide. The list came to me for agreement and I sent it back to have more details added. After this repeated itself a few times Kanyah complained that I was making her (and presumably the Thai gardener and Noi) do “hard work”.

In no kindly manner (you’ll understand what I mean) I explained that it was I who had to do a thousand times more hard work back in the U.K. to earn the money to pay for the garden than she was doing in Thailand to make the list.

Eventually the list was agreed and signed by the Thai gardener.

There were still some omissions to which Kanyah said something like “Never mind he has to do that”.

Below is a copy of the list from the exercise book and a rough English translation made by Kanyah as I sit typing this out. Click here or on the image to see the full size version as a .pdf file.

Pakchong Retirement House Gardening Contract

Gardening List English Translation

Below is the rough translation into English of the gardening contract written in Thai in the exercise book

Date: 30/12/2011

1. Put the soil 5 trucks in front

2. Put the soil 8 trucks in the back

3. Put the sand 3 trucks in front

4. Put the sand 6 trucks in the back

5. Grass – Japanese 350 Talang metre in front

6. Grass Malaysia – 16 Talang metre

7. Grass Malaysia – 500 Talang metre in the back

8. “Mai Brob” Growing the tree 50 “ton” (50 trees about 3 m high).

9. “Tiang Tong 1,000 ton”. Small tree plants 1,000.

10. Little and small plants grow around all the fence.

11. Put in the pot “Daily Ga-Tang” (Plants)

12. Four Post “covered terrace” to grow the plants. The posts to be hard wood. He will put the plants.

Everything 120,000 Baht. (£2,500 or $3,750)

Take time 3 months.

Start 10 Jan 2012

Finish 10 March 2012

Signed: Surapon Chua Ngang

Warranty people: Jalan Mea Na Lu Ji (Noi – our neighbour)

Payment Schedule:-
10 Jan 20,000 Baht
10 Mar 40,000 Baht
10 Apr 60,000 Baht
Total 120,000 Baht

Included but not written down is:-

Clearing the ground.

3 Months guarantee. i.e. after 3 months all the plants have to be healthy or the Thai gardener has to replace them. The Thai gardener is responsible for looking after the plants in this period.

What Do You Think?

Our land is 80m X 20m = 1,600 m2 (one Rai). About 600 m2 is taken up with the house and Terrace and about 200 m2 by the drive leaving around 800 m2 to be landscaped. The total in the Contract is 850 m2 – see above)

So 120,000 Baht / 800 m2 = 150 Baht/m2. Is that a fair price?

Before giving your opinion in the Comment Box below, please quickly review the Scope of Work (i.e. The Contract) above which includes 22 trucks of sand/soil, 850 m2 of turf, 50 trees about 3 m high and 1,000 small tree plants, little and small plants grow around all the fence plus the Terrace.

Today Is The Official Completion Of Our Retirement House In Packchong (Pak Chong), Thailand, As Kanyah Moves In

7th November 2011 – Another Difficult-to-Forget 7/11 Date

Today’s the date that as I reported in the Move-In Date Fixed – Thailand Retirement House Build Project Finished… ? Post the monks will come to bless the house and Kanyah will move in to reside there.

The retirement house build project is officially finished.

Silence From Kanyah In Pakchong (Pak Chong), Thailand

Kanyah phoned me yesterday to tell me (again) about the monk’s visit today. But she was very subdued and didn’t sound at all excited. “Send me more money” was the theme of her call.

But she did mention that two water tanks to collect water from the roof had been delivered – each tank 4 m3 capacity. She also said that she had bought a kitchen for 50,000 Baht and had to pay more for the builder to fit it. When I pressed her for details of what was in this kitchen she had bought she said that it was a cooker and kitchen cabinets like in the West. So much for my theory of a Thai kitchen on the Move-In Date Fixed – Thailand Retirement House Build Project Finished… ? Post

I’m not surprised that she hasn’t phoned today – it’s Kanyah’s way. No phone call, no photos, nothing.

Kanyah received for house address (Baan Lek Tee ) on 29th October 2011 as I reported on the
Thai House Address – Baan Lek Tee In Thai Language Post and promised to send me a scan of it to put on the website. That was well over a week ago and nothing arrived so far.

Fine when she wants money and I send it to her immediately. But she can’t even be bothered to send me a scan of the house address or any progress photos. That last time she sent me photos from our retirement house build project in Thailand was on Mon, Oct 17, 2011 at 3:15 PM and that is just two weeks ago.

Thinking Of Marrying A Thai Woman And Building A Retirement House In Thailand?

My advice? Read this Post and all the other Posts on this website, read the Dont Retire To Thailand page and think carefully. Above all don’t rush in.

What Next in The Retiring In Thailand Story?

Well, “all” we have done so far is to buy a car in Thailand (Toyota Hilux Pickup), bought some land and built a retirement house in Pakchong (Pak Chong), Thailand.

I haven’t done any retiring at all so there’s that to look forward (?) to…

But let’s get practical.

• She (we) need furniture for the house.
• I need to buy my machine tools and hand tools for the workshop.
• I want a big freezer stocked up with farang food and a bigger fridge stocked up with cool beer.
• I need an Internet connection, my work desk and executive chair…

And my next trip to Thailand is for Christmas and New Year coinciding with the Pakchong (Pak Chong) Cowboy City festival.

I thoroughly enjoyed last year’s festival as recorded (complete with movies) on the Pakchong Cowboy City Countdown 2011 – Happy New Year 1 page and this year it can only be better.

My Model Engineering Workshop In Pakchong (Pak Chong), Thailand

Maybe I’ll send some money to Kanyah for her to buy the furniture so that I can spend my visit looking for machine tools. Steve W tells me that there are streets in Bangkok selling second-hand lathes and milling machines at reasonable prices.

Here are some photos of machine tools for sale in Bangkok that I have found on various Thai websites:-

Second-Hand Lathe for Sale in Bangkok 003

Above, this second-hand lathe for sale in Bangkok, Thailand is advertised on the http://www.machinethai.com website.

Below is a half-decent milling machine for sale on the same website.

Second Hand Milling Machine for Sale in Bangkok 003

My ‘Beautiful’ Workshop Floor Will Be Messed Up In No Time !

Above, these machine tools do a messy job of machining metal. A lot of oil is spalshed on the metal cutters to lubricate it an keep them cool. The metal cuttings (swarf) fly in all directions making an oily dirty mess everywhere.

The ‘beautiful’ marble terrazzo floor that Kanyah has put into my workshop See the (Mission Creep – Costs Escalate – Time Overruns – Photos Show Why) Post will be completly ruind as soon as one of these heavy machines is dragged into position.

Here’s another website selling machine tools in Bangkok:-

http://www.thaimachinetools.com/?machine-type=lathes

To save you leaving this page I have posted a photo of a typical machine tool of the type I’m likely to be putting in my workshop below:-

Another Second Hand Lathe for Sale in Bangkok

I must admit that these machine tools are a bit bigger and older (worn out) than I really want. It’ll take me some time in Bangkok to find small machines in good conditions with lots of accessories.

So, I have my goal set for this forthcoming visit – to set up my model engineering workshop in Pakchong (Pak Chong), Thailand.

After that, it’s back to the UK to earn more money to replenish my depleted pension pot so that I can eventually retire in Thailand.

I expect that Kanyah will stay on in Pakchong (Pak Chong) until the (UK) spring or summer to give her time to make the Pakchong (Pak Chong) house garden ‘beautiful’.

About Steve W

Steve is very knowledgeable (in general but also about Thailand). Some photos of Steve’s houses on these pages:-

• Si Khiu Korat House 1
• Si Khiu Korat Farm

I met Steve out in Pakchong last Christmas and we have kept in touch ever since. His Thai wife is now expecting twins.

Steve (unlike kanyah) just sent me some photos showing the progress on his retirement house build project in Si Khiu Korat near to Pakchong (Pak Chong) and I’ll upload those to the website in the next few days.

Kanyah Now Has The Thai House Papers – And We Have The Baan Lek Tee (House Address)

A Time To Celebrate – At Last Kanyah Has Her Name Registered On Her Own House Papers And I Have An Address In Thailand!

Wow! What an exciting moment for Kanyah. She phoned me just a few minutes ago to tell me that she now has the Thai house papers with he name registered on them.

Then an hour later a tearful Kanyah phoned me again to tell me, guess what, that “she now has the Thai house papers with her name registered on them!”.

(She loves to repeat things as I’ve said before)

This Is A Lifetime’s Dream Come True For Kanyah

Now Kanyah is so, so happy, that her dream of owning her own house and having her own house papers with her name on them has now actually come true. In her phone calls she thanks me profusely in English and Thai.

Yes, we had a house in England but she never really assimilated (anybody go the correct word?) to that as being ‘hers’.

Kanyah Is No Longer The Tramp With No Place To Call Home

Now she truly does have a house and a place that she can call home – after 30 years of following me around the world like a tramp. (Not a poor one but a tramp nevertheless)

It’s not surprising that she is jubilant, happy and at last fulfilled. Not surprising then that she thanked me so much.

In Thailand The House Papers Are A Passport To All Official Business

What I mean is (and people familiar with Thailand will know this) that to do any just about official business in Thailand a Thai must show the house papers with their name registered on them. Without the house papers (and their name on them) a Thai person is basically non-existent – a gipsy for want of a better word.

Here are some of the things you need the house papers for:-

• To obtain a Thai ID card
• To obtain a thai passport
• To obtain a driving license
• To open a bank account
• To get married
• To obtain a British visitor’s (or any other) Visa

(If you know of any more, please post a comment or send me an email)

It seems that my words are getting through to Kanyah

If you have read my other posts then you will no that I’m pretty direct with Kanyah and let her know in no uncertain terms what I want her to do. I have for months and weeks been pushing her to get these house papers.

At last my harassment seems to have bourn fruit. Just as my ranting and raving back in May of 2011 about the standard of workmanship and the failure of Jalan to supervise the construction led eventually to Kanyah giving the previous builder and Jalan the push. (Pushed out i.e. she sacked them). There is a Post about those ‘dark days’ at “Thai Retirement House Building Project From Hell – And I’m Sick Of It” and related Posts.

So those of you who ask me to ‘go gentle’ on Kanyah take note. Pushing her brings results!

It might be painful but that’s life. If you don’t push for what you want in life you’ll get what they give you.

About The Thai House Address – Baan Lek Tee In The Thai Language – And The House Papers

Well I’ve just about said what I want to say on this subject – that is until Kanyah send me a copy of the house papers.

I’ll then post a copy here and get them translated into English and put the translation up here also. And then I’ll know Kanyah’s (and my) address in Thailand so I’ll send her a letter.

Here Is A Copy Of The Thai House Papers

Placeholder for the Thai House Papers

What More Can They Get Wrong With This Thai House Build Project?

How They Covered Up The Ugly Electrical Wiring By Trashing The Concept For The Vaulted Ceiling

What are those idiots up to? They have a set of construction drawings produced my our Thai Architect in Bangkok which they are supposed to be following. But – yet again – they choose to ignore the drawings and do what they feel like. At the expense of the lovely high and open feel the house would have had if it had been contructed as designed and also at the expense of thousands of additional Baht for the wood they used which is not needed by the design.

How The Ceiling Should Look

If you are a regular here, you will know the picture below which is the design concept for the house ceiling (i.e. there isn’t one):-

Concept For The Vaulted Ceiling

Above, the concept for the vaulted ceiling in our retirement house under construction in Pakchong (Pak Chong), Thailand.

You can see what a lovely ‘airy’ feeling you will get as you walk into the room. It’s beautiful.

And They Have Ruined It

Look at the same picture below, where I have marked up what they have done with the ceiling:-

Where They Put A Flat Bamboo Mat Ceiling

All that lovely high level space thrown away. And the detail of the vaulted ceiling (like the above photo) was clearly shown on the Thai Architects house plans we commissioned.

Extracts From The Thai Architect’s House Plans Clearly Showing The Vaulted Ceiling With Bamboo Mat

Below is one of our Thai Architect’s house plans for the retirement house now being built in Pakchong (Pak Chong). This drawing is actually a cross section through the house and I have marked a rectangle in red colour that is shown in close-up in the next image.

Thai Architectural Drawing - Check Out The Detail Indicated On The Next Image

Below is the close-up taken from the construction drawing above and you can clearly see the text “4mm Thk. Plywood finish with bamboo mat” together with an arrow from the note to the ‘herring-bone’ cross-hatching that represents the bamboo mat in the vaulted ceiling.

This is a clear description of the requirement for the house to have a vaulted ceiling and not a flat ceiling as the builder has now installed.

Thai Architectural Drawing Clearly Showing Bamboo Mat on 4 mm Plywood

In case you are thinking that the above note is only in the English language and perhaps the builder can’t read English (which is true, but Kanyah can) I’ll refer you to a Thai language note on another construction drawing made as part of the set by our Thai Architect in Bangkok:-

Thai Language In Bamboo Mat Architectural Drawing

In the image above (an extract from the Thai house plans made by our Thai architect), note the Thai language note circled in red colour and the arrow clearly pointing to the ‘herring-bone’ cross-hatching that represents the bamboo mat in the vaulted ceiling.

Below is  a close-up of the Thai language note:-

Thai Thai Language In Bamboo Mat Architectural Drawing

Above, I think this refers to the bamboo mat in the vaulted ceiling. I’ll get it translated and put the English language translation here.

Now For Some Photographs Of  How The Bamboo Mat Ceilings And Bamboo Mat Walls Were  Actually Installed On Site In Our Pakchong (Pak Chong) Retirement House

The first photo (below) is a photo of the bamboo mat flat ceiling I drew attention to in the marked-up photo above.

Bamboo Mat Ceiling 08

Above, I must admit that the bamboo mat installation is very neat and clean. I like the wooden trim in the corner between the wall and ceiling. What a pity they didn’t follow the vaulted ceiling concept.

This Is How They Hid Away The Ugly Domestic Electrical Wiring

In the Post “Don’t Let Them Wire Your House In Thailand Like This“ I showed photographs of how the builder’s electricians had installed the domestic electrical wiring and electrical conduit in areas where it would be visible. I complained of this to Kanyah and after talking to the builder she gave me a list of reasons why “I was talking rubbish and the Thai builders know best” or words to that effect.

Well now I know why they weren’t concerned about the wiring being visible. Look at the photo above or below and behind that flat bamboo mat ceiling lies hidden the ugly electrical wiring.

Next is a photo showing the bamboo mat ceiling and bamboo mat walls.

Bamboo Mat Ceiling and Walls

Above, this is a view inside the house in the Kitchen looking out onto the Balcony. In the corner the concrete column is exposed. This was supposed to have been painted before the bamboo mat was installed and failure to do this was one of the reasons why Kanyah sacked the previous builder!

Next picture shows the bamboo mat walls and the wooden floor.

Bamboo Mat Ceiling Walls And Wooden Floor

In the photo above you can see the bamboo mat walls and the wooden floor. At high level are the wooden joists to support the flat bamboo mat ceiling. Also visible is the unpainted concrete column in the corner of the room.

More detail on the wooden frame to support the bamboo mat ceiling in the photo below.

Wooden Support Frame For Bamboo Mat Ceiling 01

In the photo above you can see the wooden frame they have installed to support the flat bamboo mat ceiling.

This was never intended, never in the design and never in my budget. I have had to pay the full cost of this wood on top of the cost of the original house just to get something I don’t want!

One thing to notice is the white concrete beam running left to right above the ceiling. With the vaulted ceiling this would have been visible. Perhaps that’s why Kanyah decided to go for the flat ceiling – to hide this beam.

I should add that the provision and position of this beam was an oversight by the original Thai Architect, in my view. (He would no doubt have a different view)

The beam is not shown on the Architect’s house plans, but is shown on the structural engineering drawings. Of course, I checked the Architectural drawings quite carefully, but paid less attention to the structural drawings expecting them to be in harmony with the Architect’s Drawings. Big mistake.

Don’t Expect The Thai Architect To Check The Work Of His Sub-Specialists!

By sub-specialists I mean the other engineering disciplines who contribute their expertise to the overall house design and these are mainly the structural engineer and the electrical and mechanical services engineer.

There are several instances where our Thai Architect did not show or check the detail of the structural engineers drawings and these were not spotted either by myself or by the previous builder. Also, there were items in the electrical and plumbing drawings that were incorrect and had to be put right by the builder.

I’ll not go into the detail here – this page is about the bamboo mat ceiling and walls – but maybe make a feature page of all the design errors separately.

Next, a view looking towards the bathroom doors from the Dining Area.

Red Brick Bathroom Walls 02

In the above photograph above the two white rectangles are the door frames to the two bathrooms.

In the foreground where the worker is standing, this is the Dining Area. Again, you can see the flat bamboo mat ceiling instead of the vaulted ceiling.

Next, a  close-up of the bathrooms.

Red Brick Bathroom Walls 01

In the above photo, you can see my shower room where the worker is standing and Kanyah’s bathroom to the right.

Notice the grey coloured vertical strip to the right of the picture in the red brickwork and then look at the photo below.

Hidden Electrical Wiring Near The Red Brick Bathroom Walls

Above, the grey coloured strip is where they have cut into the red brick wall of the bathroom to bury the yellow conduit for the electrical wiring.

At the top you can see the yellow conduit rising past the concrete beam. As it happens, I had agreed with the previous builder that this half of the house could have flat ceilings (as a cost saving measure – but obviously now its costing me more than the vaulted ceiling if they are putting in the flat bamboo mat ceiling requiring the wooden support frame).

How The Flat Ceilings Were Supposed To Save Me Money

The vaulted ceiling concept was originally applied to every room in the retirement house except for the bathrooms and the small lobby outside of the bathrooms. These were to be flat ceilings made from gypsum board suspended on steel wires.

The original builder’s quotation was above our budget and so before we signed the construction contract with him we went through a ‘Value engineering’ (VE) exercise to get the cost down. (VE – AKA Cost Cutting)

The original builder offered a considerable cost saving if the bedrooms could also be flat ceilings made from gypsum board suspended on steel wires.

I don’t think that Kanyah was up to speed with this, although the previous builder was supposed to mark up the original drawings to show all changes agreed as part of the VE exercise.

So we might have flat bamboo mat ceilings in the bedrooms with the expensive wooden support rafters that you have seen in the photos above.

By the way, strange that Kanyah has not sent me any photos of the bedroom areas. Wonder what she’s up to in there….

In The Next Post We Move To Photos Of The Outside Of The House

I have today received a whole stack of photographs of the external of the house, and oh boy has it moved on. Now you really can see the end in sight.

The photos include:-

• Massive beautiful (and expensive) Teak double doors to the ground floor workshop (another change I wasn’t asked about)
• Bamboo mat applied to the underside of the balcony roof. (Despite me telling Kanyah I didn’t agree to the builders price she did it anyway)
• External views showing the finished wood walls – and how nice it looks.
• The steps up to the balcony (including a departure they made  from my very detailed design that they should not have made)

And of course you get my usual complementary (not complimentary) commentary!

Don’t Miss it.

Building A Retirement House in Thailand

We are more than just planning to build a retirement house in Thailand we are well on with the house plans. You can see some of those on this website at http://retiringinthailand.net/house-build-thailand-2/

Those plans I made myself on AutoCad but did I did start with a basic house design I downloaded from this Thai website:-

http://www.dpt.go.th/download/PW/house_model/framehome.html

The next stage is to obtain budget quotations for my house design before moving to the next stage. I’ll be doing this over the internet and will tell you exactly how when I have been through the process myself.

But before I seek the quotes, there are a few things I need to do to the house drawings to provide more information. (These may well be done when you read this – depends upon what time you came to this post).

Here’s what I’m going to do next to the drawings for of our Thai retirement home:-

• Add to the drawings:-
  • Sink and drain in the Workshop
  • Designate the WC and shower area walls as being made from brick
  • Add a finishes schedule showing what materials and finishes are to be used for walls, floors and ceilings
  • Add the folding windows to the Living room
• Make a cross section though the building
• Add some Thai language notes

So you can see I still have plenty to do before I start to get budget quotations from Thailand for our planned retirement house.

Keep in touch and I’ll update the web page holding the Thai house drawings as soon as I’m ready.